David Vogel


EP 132: David Vogel (Autogenerated)

[00:00:00] Dane Reis: [00:00:00] you booked it. Episode 132. Okay, let’s get started. I am excited to introduce my guest today. David Vogel, are you ready for this David? 

[00:00:16]David Vogel: [00:00:16] I am ready, Dane. So excited to be here.

[00:00:19] Dane Reis: [00:00:19] right on. Glad you’re here. Dave is a graduate of the Boston conservatory with a BFA in musical theater. He has worked extensively in and out of New York city.

[00:00:30] Whether it be Broadway tours, regional or overseas within a year of graduating. Dave was graced with the opportunity to join the national tour of Chicago, the musical, . Where he eventually made his Broadway debut in the New York company as a vacation replacement.

[00:00:46] After almost four years of working in many different productions of Chicago,  including performing on the largest ship in the world. At the time, Dave took the artistic leap and moved back to the city to audition for it. Other projects since then, Dave has worked regionally in such productions as.

[00:01:03] Lay is at North shore music, theater, Greece at pioneer theater company. And most recently as King Arthur in a newly adapted version of Camelot at the farmer’s alley theater in Michigan. Dave is currently living in New York city with his husband, Matt, and cannot wait for a safe return to theater. Dave, that is a quick intro of who you are and what you’ve done, but why don’t you tell us a little bit more about yourself, fill in the gaps and a little bit more about what you do as a professional in the entertainment industry.

[00:01:37]David Vogel: [00:01:37] True Dame. Um, as a entertainer , uh, my main focus is musical theater. Um, growing up, uh, I’m originally from Rochester, New York. I. Uh, caught the theater bug very, very early. Uh, my mom really pushed me into it. She was a lover of classical musical theater growing up in high school.

[00:01:53]Uh, it was always a question whether or not I wanted to go into opera musical theater. So, uh, the Boston conservatory was the perfect school for me because they really had a wonderful hand in, uh, I really loved all of the vocal teachers at the conservatory. They were really focused on a really big in depth on classical repertoire.

[00:02:12] So that was a good thing for me. Um, uh, what else? Yeah, I would, um, musical theater is my main focus again, classical musical theater. 

[00:02:20] Dane Reis: [00:02:20] beautiful.  Let’s move on to our first section here. And Dave, look, I am a sucker for a good quote. What is your favorite quote? You’d like to share with everyone

[00:02:33]David Vogel: [00:02:33] Well, Well, not to be cliche, but I’m sure many actors do say this, but I found that throughout my career, this quote has come up so many times, especially in big crossroads in my career. And it is to own self, be crew William Shakespeare and said by Polonius in Hamlet.

[00:02:51]Dane Reis: [00:02:51] , so good. And can you expand on that a little bit on how that has been influential throughout your career?

[00:02:58]David Vogel: [00:02:58] Yes. I would say the first time that came up was actually as I was doing Chicago, the musical. So I had, it was probably going into my third year of. Performing in the production. And the role I performed was Mary sunshine. And the role is a really interesting role. It’s a role. I never thought I would play.

[00:03:18]Uh, it’s uh, uh, male soprano, who is dressed up like a woman and delete Flynn reveals, uh, the implant female reporter to be a man at the end of the year. And I was so happy with this, but, you know, getting into almost four years of performing and I was just kind of like. I’m so grateful for the opportunities that this brought, but I really need to like take a moment and be like absolutely what I want to do for my entire career.

[00:03:42] And when I really thought about it and really thought about what is true to me and what is true to my aspirations for this industry, I realized I needed to just take that leap and I need to be true to myself. And I needed to try to expand my versatility as a performer.

[00:03:57]Dane Reis: [00:03:57] Yeah, I’m really glad you brought that up because we are a weird breed, us entertainers, uh, and we all. Have our own different relationship with work. I believe, because look, there are plenty of entertainers out there that you’re totally happy if get that great show, whatever it might be. And you’re happy to be in that show for the majority or the bulk of your career.

[00:04:21] That’s totally cool. There’s nothing wrong with that. But also know that if you are enrolling, you’ve been doing it for a while and you’re like, Oh God, I feel like I need to do something else. I feel like I need. Something that that’s not an uncommon way to feel as an entertainer. I know myself personally, clearly yourself as well, Dave, that.

[00:04:40]Doing things for too long, the same thing, as much as you love it, and as grateful as you are for it. And you’re like, I, I’m still a creative person. I need to do a new project, something that is going to fulfill me in a different way, or make me the creativity work in a different way. And I think that’s very common or us entertainers.

[00:04:58] And I think the normal muggles of the world might see that as super unreliable and just a bit chaotic or frenetic, but it’s just. How we continue moving forward is how we progress through our lives.

[00:05:11]David Vogel: [00:05:11] Oh, a hundred percent.

[00:05:13]Dane Reis: [00:05:13] Yeah. And let’s move on to this next section here. And Dave, of course you are an entertainer, I’m an entertainer. And I think that you would agree that this industry can be one of the most subjective, brutally, honest, personally emotional industries in existence. And you know, you know, as well as I. That in order to create and have a successful career in this industry like you’re having now, it takes a lot of dedication and hard work.

[00:05:44] And while yeah, there’s an outrageous amount of fun and excitement being an entertainer, doing what we do. There are also our fair share of obstacles, challenges, and failures. We are going to experience and we’re going to have to move forward through. So tell us, what is one key challenge, obstacle or failure you’ve experienced in your career?

[00:06:04] And how did you come out the other side better because of it.

[00:06:08]David Vogel: [00:06:08] Oh, that’s a tough one.

[00:06:10] Dane Reis: [00:06:10] I know it’s a full on question.

[00:06:12] David Vogel: [00:06:12] yeah. Uh, it’s I, again, I think every individual is different and ironically for me, uh, you know, if we were to. Say Oh, with my career. What was that the most notable credit to date that I’ve been graced with so far? Honestly, that role has proved to be my biggest obstacle in the industry.

[00:06:31] And I love that you said this industry can be one of the most brutally honest, you know, it just really makes you take a deep, hard look at yourself and. As happy as I was to receive such an opportunity at such a young age. So, you know, uh,  just this specific of a role. You know, really pigeonholed me in a way, in terms of many casting directors, visions of me and you know what, 23 at the time.

[00:07:00] And I’m in my early thirties now, and I’m still trying to change perceptions that were made of me 10 years ago. I mean, if we think back to what we were like 10 years ago, I mean, I’m completely different, you know, you know, 

[00:07:12] Dane Reis: [00:07:12] I don’t even have hair anymore. Well, Well, I’ve got a few. I got, I got, I got, I got, I got up here. Let’s be honest.

[00:07:19]David Vogel: [00:07:19] I I’ve seen you. I know you are parents. Um, but yeah, I mean, and my hair is gray by the way. So everything changes, I would say, um, a more personal note was, um, my weight honestly has been an obstacle and I feel that, uh, I was able to, you know, once I was kind of taking in that, wow, people are really looking at me in a specific light I’ve learned through that obstacle that I need to take control of whatever I could take control of.

[00:07:45] So I would say at least the last 45 years fitness has really been something that’s helped me, try to deal with that obstacle.

[00:07:53]Dane Reis: [00:07:53] Yeah, it’s so good that you, you brought that up because.  you said, , take control of what I can control. And that’s the, that’s the important part, because there’s so much of this industry that is so far out of our control, that to worry about it is. Almost a waste of time. And the hard part about that is that we want to pay attention to the things that we can’t control.

[00:08:16] Cause they’re, they’re the big things. It’s did you book the contract? Are you the right look for the contract? You want the job or whatever it is? Those are the ones. That’s the stuff that you want to focus on because that is more or less the end goal. But all of those things are so far out of your control that you have to remove yourself from them and look at just yourself personally, 

[00:08:36] what can you do to improve your skill set the way you look and what you bring to the table?

[00:08:42]David Vogel: [00:08:42] So much easier said than done.

[00:08:44] Dane Reis: [00:08:44] Oh, a million percent. A million percent. And it takes daily practice. Doesn’t it?

[00:08:48] David Vogel: [00:08:48] Yes. A hundred percent.

[00:08:50]Dane Reis: [00:08:50] Yeah, well, let’s move on to a time that I like to call your spotlight moment. That one moment in time you realized, yes, I am going to be an entertainer for a living or maybe it was, yes, this is what I need to be doing as an entertainer. Tell us about that.

[00:09:13] David Vogel: [00:09:13] Well, uh, kind of like why, what I said before, there was never really a time in my life where I didn’t think that I was going to be a performer. Um, my mom has told me stories of when I was three years old, that I was jumping around singing all. The songs from the Disney films that I’m like, Oh, I’ve seen pictures.

[00:09:30] So yeah, that must be true. But I’m also the biggest joke was that I was singing before I was talking. So I was like, for those three years of not talking, certainly made up for that now.

[00:09:42]so I would say it kind of just was always instilled in me literally since I can remember, but I would say my, it, it moment for me was when I was about nine.

[00:09:54] I want to say, uh, there was this, uh, I want to say it was the 1994 symphonic recording of Jacqueline Hyde came out and it was with Anthony Warlow and Linda Eder. And. I heard this song. This is the moment. And I went, Oh, mom, I really want to buy that recording. And she was like, Oh, Jacqueline, Hyde up knows that’s a problem.

[00:10:17] So she was like, sure. Yeah. Yeah. So we bought it and I would literally listen to it in the car on repeat over and over again. And I fell in love with Anthony Warlow and Linda header. And then we made our first trip as a family, to New York city in 1997 for around Thanksgiving. I want to say. And Annie was playing at the time with Nell Carter and my mom was like, Oh, we should go see Annie.

[00:10:42] And I was like, no, I want to see Jacqueline.

[00:10:46] Dane Reis: [00:10:46] Yeah, I’ve been listening to this CD.

[00:10:49]David Vogel: [00:10:49] Like on repeat over and over. So she took me to see Jekyll and Hyde. And when I saw that show and Robert coochie Ali singing, this is the moment I was like, that is my dad is my it moment. That is my, I need to do this for a living.

[00:11:04]Dane Reis: [00:11:04] Oh, that’s so good. I love it. And  you got to show you want it.

[00:11:10] David Vogel: [00:11:10] I know who can say that.

[00:11:15] Dane Reis: [00:11:15] All right. Well, let’s piggyback on that real quick and talk about your number one, booked it moment. Walk us through that day, the auditions and call backs. If they happen to be a part of it and what was going on in your life. And what about that moment? Makes it your favorite? Booked it moment.

[00:11:34]David Vogel: [00:11:34] All right. So I’m going to ask if I can give two, but I’ll give them cause they are equally important to me.

[00:11:41] Um, I’m going to make them very quick though. Okay. So the first one was when I booked Chicago, um, it was, it was an incredible day slash. Months, because there was a little bit of a waiting period, but I remember that I was literally finishing doing my children’s theater works tour and it was our final performance and it was in long Island and I had to somehow do the performance at 10:00 AM and get to Ripley Greer studios in Midtown by two o’clock. So I remember we did the show, we packed it up and we were in traffic. And I was freaking out and I literally walked up to the floor of Ripley, walked in, sat down. And as soon as I sat down, uh, the monitor came out and said, David Vogel. And I just, I didn’t even get to warm up that part of my voice yet this high soprano falsetto extension, I was just like, Oh, well, we’re just going to do this.

[00:12:39] Dane Reis: [00:12:39] let’s do it.

[00:12:41]David Vogel: [00:12:41] And honestly, looking back. Uh, I think that’s actually what benefited me was that I didn’t have time to overthink it. So I walked in and it was, uh, the amazing Duncan Stewart was sitting there and he just smiled. And, um, you know, he just played the first chord, the accompanist, and I just sang, I sang the cut and when I finished, uh, Duncan just said, great.

[00:13:04] And then he said, can you come back at four o’clock today? And I was like, Oh, sure. He was like, it’s nothing big. Just, just come back at four. So then I was like, right, right. So I remember I was just kind of like wandering around for an hour. 

[00:13:18] Dane Reis: [00:13:18] Okay. Great. Now 

[00:13:18] do I 

[00:13:19] David Vogel: [00:13:19] in, I right. And I called my agent, my manager, excuse me.

[00:13:23] And he was like, okay. He was like, yeah, that’s fine. He was like, you know, just it’ll be fine. And then when I walked back at four, I saw there were like, 10 other guys, and I’m just sitting there waiting and the monitor comes out, calls the name, that guy goes in, closes the door within a minute. That guy walks out and the monitor comes back and says, actually, let me just see David Vogel.

[00:13:48]And I was like, Oh, okay. And then I walked in and it is. The music director of Chicago, Duncan, Stewart, and other members of the creative team. And I had to sing again and then she warmed me up. Yeah. And then she made me sing the end of the song three times in a row. Which is just all these high held a flats. And then it was just, it was just a surreal moment for me. And then she said, okay, that’s great. She was like, wonderful to meet you. And then I walked out and it was a, and I remember on Monday, my manager called me and said, you are on the short list. And the shortlist met whenever there was an opening in the currently running tour or the Broadway company I would go in.

[00:14:31] And then I was just on hold for two months. Just sitting and waiting. And 

[00:14:35] then I 

[00:14:35] finally got a call. 

[00:14:38] Dane Reis: [00:14:38] You must read you just like like couldn’t sit down almost. Gosh,

[00:14:42]David Vogel: [00:14:42] It was, it was a very, very hard part of my life.

[00:14:45] Cause I was just like him just kind of waiting. And then, yeah, I got that magic call, uh, in mid February that would be flying out to join the tour. And they were so happy that they decided to also give me my Broadway debut. When they wanted to move other current Mary sunshine, Brian Lowe, who is fantastic.

[00:15:03] They wanted to move him to the tour when they were doing LA. So I got my Broadway debut.

[00:15:08] Dane Reis: [00:15:08] Oh, that is amazing. And , how was that transition going from the tour 

[00:15:14] to Broadway? 

[00:15:15]David Vogel: [00:15:15] I actually, so I did my last week of tour. I did eight shows. I was in Tucson, Arizona. Uh, I finished my two show day on a Sunday. Uh, I went home, went straight to bed. I had to get up at four in the morning to get on a plane. I flew from Tucson to. New York. I was immediately gotten a taxi, went to the theater.

[00:15:38] I had a quick put in because there is a slightly different staging between the tour and New York. And then I went on that night.

[00:15:47] Dane Reis: [00:15:47] Whoa. Talk about a whirlwind.

[00:15:49]David Vogel: [00:15:49] Yeah, it was, it was surreal. It was a very, very crazy, crazy 24 hours.

[00:15:54] Dane Reis: [00:15:54] Uh, Uh, I would say so. And what’s the other one?

[00:15:57]David Vogel: [00:15:57] So there was that, but I would say in all honesty, my most artistic booked at moment was, you know, these last few years I’ve really focused on, you know, we talked about it earlier, versatility and I really wanted to push myself. And my agent sent me this audition for a production of Camelot and. Camelot again, classical musical theater has always been my favorite and I grew up listening to Camelot.

[00:16:22] My dad is a big sports guy, but randomly he loved Robert Goulay and you loved Richard Burton, so he would play Camelot, but then he would be watching, you know, the 40 Niners play. I was like,

[00:16:35] Dane Reis: [00:16:35] Yes. He was like, I love that Camelot song. I’m a 

[00:16:38] David Vogel: [00:16:38] Yeah. Right. So, um, I was so excited and I remember it was a video audition and video auditions have always been, they just have always freaked me out.

[00:16:47] I just was like, this is not my favorite. I’m like, all right, it’s fine. So I was like, this is, if anything, I took myself out of it. And I was like, I’m just going to use this as a learning experience. And I’m going to make myself be more comfortable on camera. And it was huge audition packet. I want to say it was just under 15 minutes of material and it was crazy, but I really, really worked hard on it.

[00:17:13] I got coached on it and lucky enough, one of the scenes I needed a Gwen of year and I was like, you know what, my best friend Lauren Lucas tech will. Make me calm, so great. I’m going to have her be my Gwen of year. So I did the film waited like two weeks, didn’t hear anything. And then my agent called me a week later and said, so they want to know if you’re still interested.

[00:17:37]And I just was shocked. I just, I thought it was just a nothing. And then I said, of course, and then two days later I got the phone call and I booked King Arthur.

[00:17:46]Dane Reis: [00:17:46] Oh, very cool.

[00:17:49]David Vogel: [00:17:49] So that was, that felt like a personal triumph. So that’s why I had to,

[00:17:54]Dane Reis: [00:17:54] Yeah, absolutely. Two very distinctly different ones. So good. And let’s take a moment to talk about the present. What projects are you working on now? What are you looking forward to? And it’s a weird time, right? We are a miss this global pandemic. How do you see the entertainment industry moving forward in the next couple of years?

[00:18:16]David Vogel: [00:18:16] in terms of keeping busy during this crazy time. Um, you know, again, I think the biggest thing is that I’ve really tried to focus on what keeps me mentally and physically healthy. I’ve really thrown myself into this amazing workout program. That’s actually been awesome for a lot of people in the arts community it’s called built for the stage.

[00:18:37] So by Joe Rasco. Yeah. You can follow him on Instagram, add a built for the stage. It’s it’s incredible. And I’ve always been one that has struggled with yoga or meditation. I’ve always wanted it to work for me. It just, it just wasn’t for me. And. This workout program, the structure of it, and just, you know, pushing yourself to personal goals.

[00:18:58] It’s just been something wonderful. That’s kept me sane during this time, uh, in terms of, you know, staying with it artistically, you know, I, I updated my website. I’ve tried to find new rep in terms of music, monologues, just trying to keep busy so that, in terms of the pause that we’re on right now, I’m trying to keep my .

[00:19:18]mindset in a way that I’m ready for, whenever it comes back, just to like jump back in. And I feel like many people are doing that as well, which I think is the correct way to be during this time.

[00:19:29]Dane Reis: [00:19:29] Yeah. I mean, the mindset is one of those things that is so important, but I know for when we were going to school, that mindset training and mental health was not really anything people talked about. It’s really. Only come about in the last handful of years, that it’s been a public thing that people truly address and go,

[00:19:49] this is actually something we need to be paying attention to, especially in our field.

[00:19:55] It’s, you know, I have that question about how it is, you know, emotional and emotionally brutal. And it’s, it’s true. , your mindset is almost everything in this career, especially if you want to have any kind of longevity in this career 

[00:20:07] and. That in conjunction with the physical part, just the purely doing your skill and being ready to go with your skill.

[00:20:15] Whenever it’s needed. Those are two, but mindset is a massive 

[00:20:21] David Vogel: [00:20:21] Yes. And I, it’s funny, I, I wish back in school it was made more parents that, you know, It’s the mindset and, you know, anything physical, they can work together to 

[00:20:31] Dane Reis: [00:20:31] Yeah. Yeah. . If you’re feeling better physically, . Your mental state is better.

[00:20:36]David Vogel: [00:20:36] yes, absolutely. And I guess in terms of what I’m looking forward to, you know, I’m. Clearly, I’m looking forward to theater coming back stronger than ever. I’m really hoping, especially, you know, being a union actor. I, I really hope that the union does make sure to take the necessary precautions to keep everyone involved, stage management, you know, back of house, all the actors feeling safe, but also in terms of the industry itself, I really hope that this pause has, you know, Made people take the time to evaluate and see the need that, you know, there needs to be new art, new works, new stories need to be told, and that I’m hoping that there are more opportunities for individuals of all colors, shapes, and sizes.

[00:21:17] I just think rather than just sitting and being stagnant, this is a time for really just taking the time to think about how improvements can be made.

[00:21:26]Dane Reis: [00:21:26] Yeah, for sure. I love your insight on that.  And it is time to move on to one of my favorite sections in the interview. I call it the grease lightning round. I am going to ask you a handful of questions. I want you to answer them as quickly and concisely as possible one after another, or you ready?

[00:21:46]All right. First question. What was the one thing holding you back from committing to a career as an entertainer?

[00:21:54]David Vogel: [00:21:54] Honestly, not to be cliche, but myself, uh, I’ve always been one to be very hypercritical of myself, uh, honestly much to my own detriment. And, you know, sometimes I feel it has actually affected my performance. So in years, You know, recent years, I’ve learned to accept that I’m only human. And since then I fared much better

[00:22:16] Dane Reis: [00:22:16] Aw, wonderful insight. And the second question, what is the best piece of advice you have ever received?

[00:22:24]David Vogel: [00:22:24] in college. Um, uh, actually a professor in my acting emphasis class said, remember that you are an individual, not a character. And as I’ve matured, it has made so much more sense to me because, you know, when I was younger, there was always this urge to be what everybody else wants you to be, or be what the other side of the table wanted you to be.

[00:22:44] And I finally accepted, I can only be myself.

[00:22:47]Dane Reis: [00:22:47] Yeah. And I love that you said that because that has come up so many times in this podcast, different interviews. And I love that it keeps coming up because that means that is a truly fundamental. Aspect of what creates a successful career in this industry. And it’s so important to pay attention to that

[00:23:09]David Vogel: [00:23:09] And I think it’s something we need to be educated on. 

[00:23:11] Dane Reis: [00:23:11] yes, yes, absolutely.

[00:23:13] A little bit more. I mean, it’s hard to, it’s a tricky one, isn’t it? Because when you’re younger, . We’re still figuring out who we are as well. A lot of us, so how do you be you when you’re not even maybe a hundred percent clear on who you are. And that certainly is a challenge, but to really know that that that is a big part  , of auditioning and being successful is just bringing you to the table.

[00:23:36] And sometimes I think it needs to go beyond, you know, someone just saying the words once or twice that. To really instill it, like you said. Beautiful. And the third question, what is something that is working for you right now? Or if you’d like to go pre COVID, what was working for you before our industry went on?

[00:23:56] Pause

[00:23:57]David Vogel: [00:23:57] I know I’ve said it so many times, but honestly fitness.  it helps me mentally. It helps me physically. It helps me emotionally, uh, you know, especially, especially during the largest parts of quarantine, just getting outside and being able to go for a run or getting just the opportunity to sweat.

[00:24:15] It just. Slowly helps me to calm, you know, voices in your head that are like, Oh God, what did we do next? What’s gonna happen next, blah, blah. It’s 

[00:24:26] Dane Reis: [00:24:26] Yeah. And the fourth question, what is your best resource? Whether that is a book, a movie, a YouTube video, maybe a podcast or piece of technology you found is helping your career right now.

[00:24:39]David Vogel: [00:24:39] I’ve taken this time to really start watching more TV and films. Um, especially because TV and film, you know, so far during this pandemic has actually really tried to find ways to make things work. And I it’s a part of the industry that I would love to learn more about. So. Netflix has definitely been a good friend to me.

[00:24:59]Um, right now I actually just, we just finished, um, a month ago we finished dead to me with Christina Applegate. I just think it’s such an awesome show. And I love that this dark comedy genre, like I think the actors in that just really take it on by the rates and do such an incredible job. Um, also like looking into taking film and TV classes and.

[00:25:21] Also, yeah, just   

[00:25:23] Dane Reis: [00:25:23] Yeah. And the fifth question, if you had to start your career from scratch, but you still had all the knowledge and experience you’ve collected from your career in this industry, what would you do or not do? Would you do anything differently or would you keep it the same?

[00:25:40]David Vogel: [00:25:40] That’s a hard one, I guess I wouldn’t. Change everything that has happened in general. Um, I think I would have changed how I perceived things myself. Um, Um, I feel, you know, for going to get back to school again, it’s, I’m not putting blame, but I, I don’t know if it was made aware. I just feel there were times and maybe it’s every, every arts education.

[00:26:02] I just feel, there were times maybe I did it to myself, but I felt this. Need that, like there was competition between myself and my peers and. I don’t know that maybe I press that upon myself, but I feel that that is something that can occur and maybe has occurred for many people in this industry and what I’m happy with it, you know, upon all the journeys that I’ve taken since then, I learned that, you know, it’s my journey.

[00:26:27] It’s I don’t need to look at the person next to me. It’s just about how I am moving through my career and my process.

[00:26:35]Dane Reis: [00:26:35] Yeah, it’s my journey. I think you said that perfectly and I completely agree with you. It, it is, I think, in of itself, a bit of the nature of an arts program and especially a very high performing one, like the Boston, conservatory’s ?  there’s a bit of an inherent, uh, Competitiveness, if you will, or pressure that happens.

[00:26:56] And I know for myself personally, when I was there, that I, cause I was late ish to starting to in this career path. So I was really just figuring myself out and I really needed that place for the training. Cause I was. You know, in a lot of ways behind the eight ball from a lot of people and that’s okay.

[00:27:14] And I felt a lot of, you know, not being able to keep up or whatever that supposed to mean, you know, you know, but reflecting on it now you go, it was, it was good in your right eye. I personally would’ve changed my perception of things. That’s really the key right there. And you said that as well, is that it is your journey.

[00:27:30] You’re going to school at the end of the day. You’re not being, you are paying to be there. Not people are not paying you. You have the, you are the boss more or less because your paying them. So you take that experience and take that mindset, switch and go. I need to pull out of this program, what I need for me and concentrate on that.

[00:27:50] And that’s where you’re going to find bigger growth. And  it’s easier said than done, but try your hardest to switch your mind on that. That it’s you are there to be trained, 

[00:28:01]not to compete. 

[00:28:02]David Vogel: [00:28:02] very well said. That’s very good. That was very good.

[00:28:07] Dane Reis: [00:28:07] Oh, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Oh, I’m, I’m telling it to my 22 year old mates. Jeez. But that’s the thing that’s like, that’s the crazy part. You get a bit older and you go, Oh, right. right. All right. I can see all this hindsight 20, 20 business, but honestly, for anyone that’s listening out there, if you’re younger, if you’re in those programs, if you’re aspiring to go to those programs.

[00:28:29]You’re there to train for you to make you better. That’s the purpose of that program? Not so you can be better than your peers, cause here’s the deal. You’re gonna go out to the world and there’s going to be people that are in another universe. You know what I mean? So it’s, it’s, it’s not worth it.

[00:28:43] Comparison is never the way to go work on you. And the last question. What is the golden nugget knowledge drop you’ve learned from your successful career in this industry that you’d like to leave with everyone?

[00:28:58] David Vogel: [00:28:58] I would say kind of bouncing off that, uh, you know, feeling of needing to be competitive at the end of the day, we all entered this industry because of a love of what we are doing. And I think, I think the golden nugget is to always find the heart in the work. And, you know, if you two, you’re finding, like we talked about being in a show for too long, like if you’re really finding that it’s becoming a struggle to go to work, like no one’s forcing you to be there.

[00:29:22] We knew that being artists, we it’s for love of the work. So maybe you need to spread your wings and find it somewhere else. 

[00:29:31] Dane Reis: [00:29:31] Yeah. Yup. Yup. You’ll find your feet every time. It’s a great thing about necessity. Isn’t it And,

[00:29:39]and to wrap up this interview, it is time to give yourself a plug. Dave, where can we find you? How do our listeners connect with you? Is there anything you want to promote?

[00:29:54]David Vogel: [00:29:54] Uh, yeah, so you can find me on Instagram. My handle is at David dot a dot Vogel. Um, I also so have a website it’s www dot Dave, Anthony vogel.com. 

[00:30:11]Dane Reis: [00:30:11] Beautiful. And for everyone listening out there, I have put the links to everything. Dave just said into the description of this episode. So you can easily connect with him. Dave, thank you so much for being here and sharing your journey through this crazy industry. It’s been a pleasure to have you on

[00:30:28]David Vogel: [00:30:28] much. 

[00:30:31] .